Revenge downvotes cast - you know what to do
2 year(s) ago • 31684 views • 284 replies
Luckily, it's the first time I see a revenge downvote on Beltchecker (on my own profile to boot), but I really don't think that has a place here. "Gabriel Ruediger | 5 minute(s) ago He has nothing but a video. His instructor hasn't said a thing." Nothing. Just a video with the three founders of Alliance partaking in the promotion by my instructor. I received the downvote just two minutes after writing to Gabriel that even though my initial wallpost (which I tried to give evidence advice through before actually disputing) was met with a rather snotty reply from him, "I vote with integrity and if you add good evidence for your initial BB promotion, you'll have my vote points". Obviously, integrity is not something all black belts have in our sport. If you object to revenge downvotes on Beltchecker, you'll know what to do to help nullify it. In the case of obvious revenge votes aimed at someone else further down the line, I'd be happy to help if you post about it in this thread. |
"Luckily, it's the first time I see a revenge downvote on Beltchecker (on my own profile to boot), but I really don't think that has a place here. 'Gabriel Ruediger | 5 minute(s) ago He has nothing but a video. His instructor hasn't said a thing.' Nothing. Just a video with the three founders of Alliance partaking in the promotion by my instructor. I received the downvote just two minutes after writing to Gabriel that even though my initial wallpost (which I tried to give evidence advice through before actually disputing) was met with a rather snotty reply from him, 'I vote with integrity and if you add good evidence for your initial BB promotion, you'll have my vote points'. Obviously, integrity is not something all black belts have in our sport. If you object to revenge downvotes on Beltchecker, you'll know what to do to help nullify it. In the case of obvious revenge votes aimed at someone else further down the line, I'd be happy to help if you post about it in this thread." While he should have some sort of pictures. It doesn't matter. Was confirmed by his coach who you also voted for. No reason to have downvoted him to start with. You could simply asked him to uploaded pictures but honestly even if he doesn't their is still evidence to prove his rank so your kinda just being a dick and he followed up in kind. (Edited 2 year(s) ago) |
Honestly dude I looked at some of the people you downvoted and your out of line. Imma downvote you until you take more time to research people before downvoting them and having their profile say disputed because they don't log in everyday and care enough to respond. Several people have plenty of evidence if you just click their socials. I already managed to verify 6 of the people you downvoted.... It's one thing if you can't find anything on social media but it's another when they have clearly linked their social media and it's on their social media accounts. (Edited 2 year(s) ago) |
"BOO HOO! You poor baby! Maybe BJJ isn't for you, might I suggest taking up Tai Chi. You came on MY page, I don't know you and I certainly didn't ask for you to come on my page. You down voted my profile, even though MY PROFESSOR HAS ME VERIFIED. You don't think Id do the same to you? If you lived close, Id go to your academy and talk to you face to face, but thats not possible unfortunately . You had ZERO reason to even be on my profile, let alone down vote me. Now you're complaining like a little b!tch, because I just did the same thing that you did. You question my integrity and by default, the black belts that know me and have confirmed me. I didn't realize there was so many babies doing BJJ in Sweden." Can we please have a civilized discussion here, Gabriel? If you have a difficult time handling that people who don't know you are visiting or voting on your profile, why are you raising that issue with me and not the site developers? You're totally free to try to persuade them to make the changes you want. I have repeatedly tried to explain to you the reason of my downvote and what is lacking for it to be reversed into an upvote. And I'm willing to explain it even further, if necessary. Yes, I question your integrity. To me, integrity is something you need to have towards your own feelings and impulses as well, to be able to adher to good values and principles. Lashing out the way you do is really lacking the basic discipline and respect I believe we should teach our own students, because if we don't have that, what is our ability to choke and break joints really worth? |
"But yeah, wtf is the point of downvoting Gabe? His instructor verified him." The point is we've had instances where later instructors have had incorrect information on the previous promotion history of someone before promoting them to further BB degrees. Sometimes without the person themself even knowing something was off, as with Carlos Rojas. That's why I think the most important evidence, even if someone else has given out later BB degrees, is for the promotion from brown belt to black. I initially tried to ask for this evidence through just doing a friendly wall post, but it was deleted and I got quite an unpleasant answer on my own wall. The latter is not something in itself that I downvote for but being so defensive about providing basic belt evidence is a warning sign, based on previous experience. Also, it was obvious that just writing on the wall or sending a DM wouldn't result in evidence being added. |
Haha Now, you want to be "civilized"? No, you wanted to be the "BJJ POLICE". If you did in fact start in 1999, then you would know how disrespectful you saying anything is. My first instructor would have punched you in the face for a slight like that. Ive been doing BJJ since 1998. Ive trained with the best guys in the world, have had the opportunity to do seminars all over the world and as stated above, fought in the UFC. Im sure I have pictures of me getting my promotions, but having a 5th degree black belt confirm should be all I need to do. More than enough people have Confirmed me. Until Johan posted on my wall, I havent even been on this site. Being defensive is also a sign of feeling disrespected, especially when its easily verified. (Edited 2 year(s) ago) |
Hey Gabriel, can you acknowledge that despite you being well rounded in the bjj world no one is required to know you or some one that knows you and can credit you? And that under those circumstances posing questions and making recommendations may be a legitimate effort to ensure the integrity of this sites verification system? It is not out of malice nor disrespect, it is just that different users have different standards and, given that we are a diverse community, not all are native english speakers and somethings may sound differently than intended when we translate our thoughts (I'm sure you have encountered this when arguing with a fellow in your native language, now just imagine the likelihood of such a misunderstanding happening between people that 1) are conversing in english, 2) are native speakers of some other languages, 3) the conversation is in writing and as such body language and intonation can not help you interpret their intentions. ). Cheers |
"But yeah, wtf is the point of downvoting Gabe? His instructor verified him." The point is we've had instances where later instructors have had incorrect information on the previous promotion history of someone before promoting them to further BB degrees. Sometimes without the person themself even knowing something was off, as with Carlos Rojas. That's why I think the most important evidence, even if someone else has given out later BB degrees, is for the promotion from brown belt to black. I initially tried to ask for this evidence through just doing a friendly wall post, but it was deleted and I got quite an unpleasant answer on my own wall. The latter is not something in itself that I downvote for but being so defensive about providing basic belt evidence is a warning sign, based on previous experience. Also, it was obvious that just writing on the wall or sending a DM wouldn't result in evidence being added. |
"Hey Gabriel, can you acknowledge that despite you being well rounded in the bjj world no one is required to know you or some one that knows you and can credit you? And that under those circumstances posing questions and making recommendations may be a legitimate effort to ensure the integrity of this sites verification system? It is not out of malice nor disrespect, it is just that different users have different standards and, given that we are a diverse community, not all are native english speakers and somethings may sound differently than intended when we translate our thoughts (I'm sure you have encountered this when arguing with a fellow in your native language, now just imagine the likelihood of such a misunderstanding happening between people that 1) are conversing in english, 2) are native speakers of some other languages, 3) the conversation is in writing and as such body language and intonation can not help you interpret their intentions. ). Cheers" Fair enough. It certainly felt like an attack and Ive never been questioned about my belt/lineage before. |
"The point is we've had instances where later instructors have had incorrect information on the previous promotion history of someone before promoting them to further BB degrees. Sometimes without the person themself even knowing something was off, as with Carlos Rojas. That's why I think the most important evidence, even if someone else has given out later BB degrees, is for the promotion from brown belt to black. I initially tried to ask for this evidence through just doing a friendly wall post, but it was deleted and I got quite an unpleasant answer on my own wall. The latter is not something in itself that I downvote for but being so defensive about providing basic belt evidence is a warning sign, based on previous experience. Also, it was obvious that just writing on the wall or sending a DM wouldn't result in evidence being added." I dont know Carlos Rojas or what you're talking about. It would have been VERY easy to "verify" me, just by asking any of the people who had already confirmed me. Just because there was a different scenario doesnt give you the right to question anyone imo |
Dude still on a power trip. It legit just took me ten minutes to verify 6 people he down voted. If you want to pretend to be some bjj police then do a better job. Everyone is accountable including you Johan. Leave comments if you want but if you going to down vote you better have at least took 2 minutes to look at their social and come up empty. |
Johan, by your own standards you have nothing at all backing up your 1st and 2nd other than a statement you haven't seen your instructor but he approved over the internet. Honestly by the criteria you use in voting you would be an automatic dispute. I find it funny you don't dispute that his statement was correct as to your degrees. Gabe, it's a verification site and peer review thing that we all belong too. You have to expect someone is going to decide he is the grand inquisitor of all things pertaining to righteous promotions. Hell I have a ton of pics, articles and certificates yet he felt the need to suggest I have a video or pic of the actual black belt promotion. Don't stress it enjoy the site for what it is a good place to meet like minds in the BJJ community. Hey you are in the company of Remco on this |
I think part of the issue is some people view this site as simply a verification of current rank while others view it as a more comprehensive verification of your promotion history. I think there is more than enough evidence to verify your current rank. With nothing but respect, you might consider reviewing the dates of your black belt. It looks like you were promoted in Dec 12 of 2009. It looks like you responded to this post confirming it's accuracy. https://forums.mixedmarti[...]lt/1570042 |
"Johan, by your own standards you have nothing at all backing up your 1st and 2nd other than a statement you haven't seen your instructor but he approved over the internet. Honestly by the criteria you use in voting you would be an automatic dispute. I find it funny you don't dispute that his statement was correct as to your degrees. Gabe, it's a verification site and peer review thing that we all belong too. You have to expect someone is going to decide he is the grand inquisitor of all things pertaining to righteous promotions. Hell I have a ton of pics, articles and certificates yet he felt the need to suggest I have a video or pic of the actual black belt promotion. Don't stress it enjoy the site for what it is a good place to meet like minds in the BJJ community. Hey you are in the company of Remco on this" Imma promote myself to brown belt and master ken rank all at once so he has something to actually dispute today. |
Johan, I just got a notification that you had downvoted someone's profile that I had voted to verify (James Jones). I'm not sure I agree with this logic: "revenge voting is bad, therefore I will revenge vote all profiles of those who revenge voted against me". I think you have every right to call into question anyone's profile for any reason you see fit. Most of the time I think you're right. But not in this case. Anybody can read the downvotes on your profile, and most will be able to tell when someone is downvoting for petty reasons, so why not just let those speak for themselves and avoid being petty in return? |
"I think part of the issue is some people view this site as simply a verification of current rank while others view it as a more comprehensive verification of your promotion history. I think there is more than enough evidence to verify your current rank. With nothing but respect, you might consider reviewing the dates of your black belt. It looks like you were promoted in Dec 12 of 2009. It looks like you responded to this post confirming it's accuracy. https://forums.mixedmarti[...]lt/1570042" haha How did you even find that? I signed up on this site by request and just guessed most of the stuff since I didnt have my certifications right in front of me. Ive been in the BJJ community since 1998 and this was the first time anyone has questioned me. |
"Ive been in the BJJ community since 1998 and this was the first time anyone has questioned me." I don't think anyone is questioning your legitimacy, per se, but rather are trying to get you to fill out your profile as completely as possible, and they feel that downvoting your profile is the most effective method to achieving this goal. |
Well, I don‘t want to take part in that brawl at all…. But from my point of view one thing is quite clear: There is no objective reason any more for an actual downvoting according to the spirit and main idea of this board/instance (to verify legitimations). -And the red downvotes are really an ugly marker….😖 So it would be a nice move to skip the downvotes first (and maybe keep on kicking asses vice versa for some other reason I don‘t care about). 😉 |
"Johan, by your own standards you have nothing at all backing up your 1st and 2nd other than a statement you haven't seen your instructor but he approved over the internet. Honestly by the criteria you use in voting you would be an automatic dispute. I find it funny you don't dispute that his statement was correct as to your degrees. Gabe, it's a verification site and peer review thing that we all belong too. You have to expect someone is going to decide he is the grand inquisitor of all things pertaining to righteous promotions. Hell I have a ton of pics, articles and certificates yet he felt the need to suggest I have a video or pic of the actual black belt promotion. Don't stress it enjoy the site for what it is a good place to meet like minds in the BJJ community. Hey you are in the company of Remco on this" Thanks Phil, thanks. I figured you wouldnt get verified unless you met the criteria and 1000 points is a significant amount to meet that criteria imo. I just found it disrespectful, especially since I had already met the criteria and multiple sources agreed. I guess since Im not on this site often, it rubbed me the wrong way....especially because what he was asking, He doesnt have himself. Is Remco on here? If so , thats very cool. Also, Mac Danzig(TUF 7 winner and old training partner) is on here as well. |
"haha How did you even find that? I signed up on this site by request and just guessed most of the stuff since I didnt have my certifications right in front of me. Ive been in the BJJ community since 1998 and this was the first time anyone has questioned me." My years googling > my years training BJJ Really it was just a simply search of your name and "black belt". I knew you were an active fighter around that time and figured there might be a story or post on some forum somewhere about it. |
"I don't think anyone is questioning your legitimacy, per se, but rather are trying to get you to fill out your profile as completely as possible, and they feel that downvoting your profile is the most effective method to achieving this goal." Well, its a silly way of "asking". This is the most time Ive spent on this site and only signed up, because I was asked to. I didnt realize I needed more proof than was initially asked for. I found the "down vote" really disrespectful as I think anyone would. Still, I guess its good dialogue to have |
"My years googling > my years training BJJ Really it was just a simply search of your name and 'black belt'. I knew you were an active fighter around that time and figured there might be a story or post on some forum somewhere about it." Well, Ill fix the discrepancy and its funny thats how easy it was to "verify". Its pretty easy to find out frauds in the BJJ community |
"Just because there was a different scenario doesnt give you the right to question anyone imo" Actually, becoming a member of Beltchecker gives any other member the right to question, based on their personal criteria. Mine is that the person with the profile should provide the evidence on the profile or with very specific links. And that evidence for the promotion from brown to black is the most important, even if you have later degrees. Also, I want to treat everyone the same and hold everyone to the same evidence standards, no matter if they're UFC veterans, have shared team or lineage and so on. With background with far too many years at several different universities, I apply the same principles as in scientific writing, where no one is immune to having to provide evidence to their claims and be able to answer critical questions. And believe me, I have raised very critical questions on the research of world famous authorities in my field and no one has been the least upset about it. Very different worlds, but I believe that kind of thinking is needed if Beltchecker is to become higher regarded than IBJJF as a belt registry. Even if some get upset along the way :-) |
